124: Gay Hendricks – How To Be Incredibly Lucky

8 Secrets to Change Your Fortune

Speaker 1: Welcome to the authors who lead podcast. This podcast is dedicated to you. People who want to be inspired by authors leaders and the messages they share. This is such an important podcast to us because we help uncover what goes on behind the scenes. When authors are writing their book, we talk about the process. We talk about where they get big ideas and you can listen in on those conversations. We can't wait for you to join us. So let's get started. Everyone, a soul thoroughness here, the host of authors who lead and today is a special privilege for me. One of my author heroes and somebody who's been a great mentor and teacher to me through his books, gay Hendricks is here. He's been a leader in the field of relationship, transformation and body mind transformation for more than 45 years after earning his PhD from Stanford, 1974, gay served as professor of counseling and psychology at university of Colorado for 21 years and has written more than 40 books, including bestsellers, such as five wishes, the big leap, conscious, loving, and conscious loving after all the last two. He coauthored with his beautiful partner, dr. Katherine Hendricks. He's also a mystery novelist, which is quite fascinating featuring and Tibetan Buddhist, private detective. I can't wait to learn more about that book as well as his latest book, conscious luck, which we'll be discussing in detail today. He reveals eight ways to change your fortune through the power of intention and gain has appeared on more than 50 radio and TV shows, including Oprah, CNN, CNBC, 40 hours and others. It's a delight and a pleasure to welcome a Hendrick's the show.

Speaker 2: Welcome. Thank you so great to be with you. Yes.

Speaker 1: Well, one of the things we were talking about just before we came on the air is how much of an impact your work has had on me as a person. And my first knowing of you was in the book, the big leap, one of the things that fascinated me by the big leap was how I wouldn't say they're obvious, but how inner knowing the things you were teaching became for me it's as if I always knew them, but somehow couldn't see them. And it was like, you were telling me something, I knew all along. I was like, this is crazy. How do I know this? But I've not read this book. It's as if you opened up my mind and heart to look inside of something that was always there. Tell me a little bit more about like that process of sharing something so obvious that you obviously have a connection with, with your work with obviously clients and workshops, that experience that I had. Is that something that you've heard people say or that you had intention for? Tell me a little bit about this idea of writing about something that's so deep within other people that you're just uncovering.

Speaker 2: Yes. Thank you very much. I appreciate that question. Actually. I've never been asked that question before in that particular way. And it delights me a lot to open a space where we can talk about the deeper kinds of things like that. In my writing, what I try to do is I try to go to a depth in myself that I've not been to before, but that I'm opening up to and learning about. And as I open up and learn about that, I start using it with people and then I start teaching it. And I, after a while, it becomes something that I put in a book. And so by the time gets to a book I've been immersed in a particular principle. You know, let's say one of the big principles in the big leap happens to be opening up to your genius, to your natural genius, to your genius zone inside what I like to call the genius spiral, that once you open up to that, it carries you into life in a different way.

Speaker 2: It carries you into places that bring forth your genius more. And so what I'm up to is opening up and getting to that level in myself and finding something that's first of all, so incredibly useful to me and the people I'm working with that it would be committing malpractice if I didn't write about it and share about it. And so that's where I get to. When I start to write a book is I I've had something in like, like with conscious loving, you mentioned in the introduction, you know, for 10 years, we, Katie and I experimented on different ways of listening to each other and telling the truth to each other, you know, to develop something that we could teach in our seminars. And then, you know, once we taught it in our seminars, Oprah heard about it and we were on her show doing it.

Speaker 2: And instead of with 10 couples with 10 million people. And so things kind of go like that. And the intention though is to start with something that's so fundamentally true for me that I've just got to share it. And so that's where all my books have come from. And the same thing with the mystery novelist, the mystery novel thing, you know, that I got understood 10 years ago in writing mystery novels for my own entertainment. And I, there was some famous, British, was it Disraeli or someone like that? Who said, when I get the urge to read a good novel, I write one instead. And I love that quote. And that's what happened to me. I wanted to read a good mystery novel, but I couldn't find one. And so I decided to invent one myself and that led to getting one published and then two and then five. And now I've got a second series, by the way that I got to tell you about later, I've launched a, a series with a Victorian era, London dandy named sir Errol Hyde. And so he's my current passion.

Speaker 1: Amazing. I love that. I love to hear, I could hear the joy in your voice as you talk about these books. Cause they're, they become a family, become in you. They're part of you. So I love that, that nature of it. And when I mentioned what I was saying about this, knowing that's in you, I can see how someone who might read the book and not see it. But I think it's because they don't have this inner knowing that they're seeking. That's it. And that's the thing I really appreciated about. For example, you mentioned the zone of genius. I was talking to a client today. Who's written, her name is Heather. She's an amazing author of young scifi novels. She basically has written, when she was told six years ago, she had, she has a terminal illness. That's going to bring her pain, but it's called lupus and her mother died of it.

Speaker 1: And she would, she was given two years to live. That was six years ago. And she's writing about this idea that how writing creativity has saved her life and the how writing is really medicine, how it's really brought her so much things that other sciences couldn't do the arts powerful story. But we were talking about why she's feeling stuck. And I want her to understand this notion that the answer lies within her here, that I can only give her seeds to look places, to poke in. And I've suggested she just finished the big leap and was using a lot of the references about, I can't find my zone of genius. And as she described it, she described it perfectly. And she just wasn't seeing it very clearly because she missed it. She overlooked it. I think at least from my understanding, do you think people overlook this idea and we'll talk more about conscious luck and demo, but this is a good beginning here. Do people miss their there's zone of genius? Do they overlook it? Because a lot of people say, I don't know if I have one. When I talked to him about this principle,

Speaker 2: Actually I've been around the world now 30 some times talking about these things over the past 40 years. And one thing I've discovered is that no matter what culture I go into, that's one of the big things that happens when I talk about the subject is somebody will stand up and say, I don't think I have a genius spiral in me, or I don't think I don't see any part of me. That's a genius Einstein. I can't recall the exact quote right now, but there was a quote from Albert Einstein where he said that everybody is a genius, but then he says that it's kind of like, then we start trying to teach dogs to climb trees and cats to, uh, to chase mailman. And we get lost in training people in overlooking their true genius. To me, what you talked about in your first question about like reminding the reader of what he or she already knows and can feel inside.

Speaker 2: That's a great compliment. I am so happy that you had that experience because that's one thing I'm really aiming for. I remember my ninth grade Latin teacher, Ms. Emma Williams, who had a big influence on me, taught me my first second language. And from that vantage point of Latin, I was able to see English so much more clearly and see how to write in English in a useful way. But she always used to harp on the fact that the word education comes from the Latin word [inaudible] to lead forth or to bring forth from a person it's not about stuffing something in it's about lifting up out of a person that, Oh, I get it. You know, that moment of aha or discovery that's music to my ears. That's my version of a day long dessert.

Speaker 1: That's wonderful. I was a educator for 24 years. And one of the things that I realized over those years is that I didn't listen to children the way I should've, because they had all the answers to what they needed to learn. And, you know, I owe a lot of penance perhaps for maybe not leading them in the way that they could have led themselves. But one of the things I discovered in that is that you don't make someone learn. They choose to learn. They learn when they're ready to acquire whatever they need. And we spend so much time making them memorize things, do things that they're not really learning. They're doing for the sake of some other thing. And when I listened to young people, or when we listen to ourselves, I realized that most of my work in helping authors become better authors. Isn't my ability to write because I'm dyslexic.

Speaker 1: I couldn't read. Even at third grade, I flunked freshmen English at UCLA. I became an English teacher really by mistake because I needed a job and they accepted me. So I'm the last person likely to be a good book coach because English isn't the thing that I'm good at. I'm good at the message, that subtle thing beneath the surface, because I spent all my time trying to find the things that aren't set in words. So it just happens to make me really good at this under lying, knowing to me, that's my zone of genius. It just took me a long time to accept the fact that the thing that was really painful and hard was my genius.

Speaker 2: I wish everybody on earth could hear that message because it's so important. In fact, the very things that cause us pain are the vehicle to ride into our genius through. I'm so glad that you discovered that I, in a couple of my books, I can't remember if I put it in conscious luck, but I know I talked about it in the big leap is I grew up with a big medical issue. I was very obese from the first time I was, I mean, from the time I was born, basically by the end of my first year of life, I was in the top 2% of baby weights. I was one of those extremely fat babies. So there was something wrong glandularly inside me. And I was taken around to different medical professionals, but I grew up very fat and which I'm not now because I had an enlightenment moment when I was 24 years old.

Speaker 2: When I weighed 300 pounds, an enlightenment moment where I saw that my true self was this unconditioned, unconditional, pure consciousness part of me. And I'd never seen it before. I'd never experienced it before I thought I was my meat. I thought I was my physical being. I had never discovered that spiritual center that I think we all carry within us. And once I discovered that, then I had the power to reshape my body so that I'm now a six foot, 180 pounder rather than a six foot, 320 pounder that I was when I first woke up.

Speaker 1: Yeah, that's amazing. I found so many of the truisms in your texts and we're going to talk about conscious luck here because I really want to, to lift it up. I mean, if you haven't read bigly, I encourage anyone out there. It will help anyone and everyone who is ready to start to see themselves differently. It has sparked conversations in my relationship with my husband. When we say up, sorry about that. I was just upper limiting there for a minute. I'm doing fine. We're okay. There's just big things to come. Let's just accept that. It wasn't you, it wasn't me. It just, there's wonderful things here in this bump. So I spend a beautiful ride. It's been effortless even in these times that we're recording this things in the outward seem very difficult, hard and challenging, but inwardly, I feel nothing but peace and joy.

Speaker 1: And sometimes I wrestle with the guilt like, Oh, I shouldn't be, I shouldn't be feeling so peaceful. I'm like, Oh no, this is exactly what I should be feeling because I'm feeling it. So it's been great. The big leap is a wonderful book to help people go from really break through a ceiling that they've created for themselves. And I recommend everyone to read it. If, when set out to write that book, who did you have in mind? Obviously you mentioned that it person came from a place of need from, within you working through and understanding it. How did you decide that this book and who was the intended audience? Because a lot of times authors, they're trying to write to so many different people. They ended up not speaking to anybody. And when you write, did you have an intention? Like I have this person in mind when I'm writing a book.

Speaker 2: That's a great question. Because one of my process, things that I do is when I'm conceptualizing a book, or when I'm thinking about writing a book, I actually go into a bookstore and I go stand in the section where the book will be sold. And I imaginarily put myself in the person's place. Who's in there looking around. What does that person feeling? What does that person need? What does that person really want? Who is that person? And that helps me get my voice on the line. And once I get the voice of a particular book, the book almost writes itself. And I, I experiment in my mind before I put a word down on paper, I'm experimenting with what is the tone of it? What is the, you know, is this what I'm going for in the big leap is kind of like I'm walking down the hall with my attention fully on either the CEO of the company, or I'm walking down the hall, talking to the teenage daughter of a client of mine who has come in for one session because she's on her way to college.

Speaker 2: And what would I be, how would I be addressing each of those people? So the perfect person who reads the big leap, I wrote it for the coaching community. I wanted people out there to have a map for how to quickly get to people's heart and soul. And so I wanted to provide, you know, there's probably a million coaches and therapists out there that use my roadmap, which I discovered through working with, you know, tons and tons of clients. And so I, those are my people, you know, people who are in the transformation world, those are my customers. And then my number two type of customer that I'm interested in is a person who's maybe not coach or a consultant or anything like that, but is a person who is really interested in transformation. And how does, how do I change my life and how does life really work? And what's holding me back. And so whether it's in business or in, in the home life aspect of, or in the workaday world, it's, whoever's interested in solving a problem and moving to the next level. Those are my people.

Speaker 1: Yeah, no, that's great. No wonder. I spoke so much for me. I tell people who come to work with me while you were sent here. I don't know how you got here, but you were sent here. And I want them to know that I'm a transformational coach. We call it book coach, because that's the work we're doing. So at the end, you have a thing that we worked on that shows the evidence of our work. But my job is to focus on the author because if the author doesn't transform in some understanding our way, how do you expect else reading it to have some sort of transformation? It's not knowledge, meaning information we need that won't help anyone we're drowning in information. We need you. We need your uniqueness on a page. And if you can't see that, then neither will they

Speaker 2: A wonderful quotation from our great poet, Walt Whitman. At one point, he says, I am large and contain multitudes. And I think we all need to keep that in mind that we are very large. We contain multitudes of things within us. And our job is to open up to those things and own them and turn them into our creative process. So I appreciate that. You're saying that it's all about a continuous process of expansion in the self that the author has to keep opening up to new dimensions in herself or himself, because that's where the juicy stuff is. That's where the work is that will allow you then to speak to readers in an openhearted and honest way. That's why this is the most exciting time to be writing books and reading books, because there's so much juicy, wonderful stuff out there, I guess you probably do too.

Speaker 2: But I get bombarded. I probably get 400 people a year that write me and asked me if I can give them a blurb on my, on their book. And of course I can't because you can only do a couple of those kinds of things just for time purposes. But I do see a lot of interesting books come by me that I can't comment on because I'm just busy, but I see the synopsis of it. And people are writing about really amazing things. These days, things that you just couldn't have been reading about 10 or 20 years ago. So I appreciate the explosion and authorship that we're seeing these days,

Speaker 1: Right? And I tell people you're the perfect person to write this book. And the way I know is because you're writing it, don't be afraid. I tell people, look, every one of you, all of us, me included, we're all selling sunshine. Meaning the books. They're not new. We're not uncovering new things. It's the energy, the truth that is you're writing about whatever it is. But the difference is if you sell sunshine, you're not going to really make a difference that that's free everywhere you go that's information. But if you become the magnifying glass, the lens that you shine the light through. Now we have something that ignites. Now we have something that's so worthy of the conversation because it's different now to the focal points, different it's powerful, it's you it's you we're looking for not the content, not the sunshine. So transform yourself into the thing, the vehicle that can shine the light in a place in a way that no one else can because your life experience your knowledge, your suffering, your challenges, your beauty, all those things.

Speaker 1: I think you did a beautiful job and conscious luck doing such that very thing, the eight secrets to intentionally change your fortune. Now I was really struck the way I was. I interviewed Carol Kline. The coauthor was how this book began for those of those who had listened to the previous episode, that it was co-written by you and Carol. And that's really the beginning. You do a great job of saying, this is my voice here in the beginning, the eye where I'm talking about the book, where this came from, and then I think it's chapter four. So where it transitions to Carol taking over the week, the week conversation is directed the reader steel, and it's a seamless voice. I thought she did a beautiful job. Both of you bringing it together. How did that process feel as a writer before we dive into the information in the book to kind of, to share, really share a book or have an author pick up a book, pick up the words and carry on the message. What was that like for you as an author?

Speaker 2: Well, it was for me as an author, a total delight because Carol is amazingly gifted at just her, her overall. I mean, she's a great writer, but also she's just the most lovely human being you'd ever want to meet. And she said, no years of spiritual practice know that's made her who she is. And she's just a fabulous person to be around. I call her a freelance angel. She goes around the world, just dropping into people's lives and writing them up. But so what happened was I wrote the first chunk of the book, the first half or so of the book some years ago, after the big leap came out, I was busy on other things and trying to respond to all the stuff that happened with the big leap after it became a bestseller. And that took me around the corner a few times.

Speaker 2: And so I kept wanting to come back to conscious luck and I told Carol about it. I bumped into her at the farmer's market a couple of times, and we'll always ask each other, what are you working on? And so I would tell her about conscious luck and she was just so excited by that idea. Finally, she corralled me at the farmer's market one day and said, how about, you know, let's why don't I take that first chunk that you've written and let's see what I can do with the second half where all the processes and activities are and interviews and things like that. That sounded like a great idea to me. And so I said yes to that, my wife and I, Katie and I have collaborated on a, probably over more than 10 books now, something like that. And I love the process of collaboration and it's a very rich process for me.

Speaker 2: And I've been very blessed in my choice of coauthors by and large, my first book, which was a book on education called the centering book that I wrote in 1973, I did not have a great coauthor for that. And he ended up not fulfilling his into the stuff. And I had to write stuff that he had agreed to write, and it was kind of unique experience. And so I swore off of collaboration for a number of years, but then I got in my relationship with Katie 40 years ago and she's my dream collaborator. But Carol is just a very gifted person in many ways. And she was able to take all the rich conceptual material and build exercises around it and that kind of thing. So she was a complete delight.

Speaker 1: Yeah. Let's, let's talk about this national conscious look. I was taking some notes, so I really had a place to enter so many people who maybe have a different definition of luck. You and Carol do a beautiful job of like trying to help people understand this notion of luck so that they don't go different directions. So maybe for us here, if you got to give a simple definition for luck, help us understand what it is. And then we'll talk a bit about how, how the entry point is.

Speaker 2: Yes, a simple definition of luck would be conscious luck would be arranging to be in the right place at the right time for good things to happen at all times. And I'll tell you what luck isn't what I think our misperception of luck is is that many people think of it as like winning the lottery or kind of like a lightning strike up kind of a thing, or it's something you're born with and what Carol and I discovered through researching eight different ways that people have made themselves luckier is that luck is more like a wind. That's always blowing that we need to shape our sales too. And once we get our wings working and our sales working, the winds kind of carry us in a much more effortless way. We got that image from a professor at Stanford named Tina Selig. Who's done a lot of research on conscious luck. And she says, that's what her version of luck is that it's a wind. That's always blowing that if you can adjust the wings and sales to it, you can get to places that you never imagined in a much less effortful way by learning to ride the current

Speaker 1: Beautiful, great example. You do, you share a different ways in which you can change your fortune. One of the ones that struck me was the story you told to give people a sense of the belief that people have that they're either lucky or they're not. I think you talked about a researcher who brought people who've said they were lucky or said they were not lucky and gave them an assignment. The assignment was to look in a, I think, a newspaper for a series of a hundred and something images, right. Photographs. And to count how many there were, tell us a little about that and why you think that notion was so useful in helping explain why people perceive luck in one way or another.

Speaker 2: Well, it has to do with, let me go back to an experiment that I happened to be blown away by when I saw it when I was at Stanford. So they took one group of people and they were there's this thing called a tachistoscope, which is like a fancy View-Master. It shoots you a slide very quickly. So you can't exactly see what it was. You sort of have to guess, but your unconscious sort of sees something. So here's the example. They took a group of people and the actual thing that they were flashing was a yellow led pencil. Everybody has seen a yellow led pencil. That's what the actual picture was, but they took one group of people and they had them not eat for eight hours. And then they showed them the flashes and asked them what it was. And people saw it as a banana because they were hungry.

Speaker 2: Okay. Then they had another group of people that they showed the same thing to, but beforehand they had them drink three or four glasses of water, and then didn't let them go to the bathroom until they did the little. And this time the group saw the yellow led pencil as a river or the Amazon snaking through the jungle. They saw it as a water thing. And so one of the big things in life is what you're looking for, what you're willing to experience. That's why in the conscious luck book, I say, the very first thing you need to do is open your willingness to have your life be luckier, to actually make that something you're consciously willing to have, you know, rather than, okay, I'd be willing to do that, to actually take a moment and really open yourself. Yes, I would be willing to be luckier today than I was yesterday and luckier tomorrow than I was and luckier every day than I was the day before.

Speaker 2: So that kind of willingness that opens the gate. But in the very first chapter of conscious luck, I say, here's what really gifted people do instead of just be willing, they make a commitment to it. Anything you want to accomplish in life, you've got to be willing to make a commitment to it. If it's something big, whether it's with your husband or whoever it's with, you've got to have that take a stand for it in your life. And so in the first chapter, we show a number of ways to actually make a commitment to being luckier that actually improves your luck. And so it's, you know, the ten second version of it is just to use the mantra I'm luckier today than I was yesterday. And I'm willing to be luckier every day than I was the day before. Use a simple mantra like that. But if you've got another hour or so, get into the book and do the processes, because this happens to be a book that has processes that can really save you a lot of time and energy, you know, like there was the study, there were the one group of people counted up the images, but on the second page of the study, it said there are 42 in this document, you know, so they wouldn't have to look at it, you know?

Speaker 2: And so it's what you're paying attention to. That gives you the quality of the experience you have,

Speaker 1: Right? No, that's so that's so great. I was actually discussing with my son. I sent him he's 23 years old. I want him to read the book. And what was so interesting about the conversation is just opening your mind to the idea that you can change. Your luck is a huge leap forward, just the, that alone. If you do that. And there's sort of the experience you had when you went with your friend to the movies and you had the drawing for the watch you described in the book, I was like, what if I just was lucky from this day forth? I just felt this joy and this truth to it. And you do some wonderful exercise in the book where you say there are times in your password, you had unlocked perhaps in your family, your life and your own life relatives before you were born and doing that exercise where you said that was then, and this is now was so freeing release myself from any thing that I was holding onto that maybe some consciously that I didn't know, I was saying deep down inside.

Speaker 1: So those so great exercises. I want to talk about a chapter that really struck me, that I, I had been wrestling with where my, some of my biggest questions came from. And one of those was the transformation that happens with shame. And the reasons shame may be difficult to detect in some of us was one of the questions I had. Why do you think shame sometimes hard to detect. And I use the lens of one of the words that were said in the book, which is scan your whole body with the microscope of your awareness. And that struck me like lightning bolt, because I didn't realize I had a microscope to use to look within my awareness. So I was like, Oh, I have a tool I did not use. That's fascinating. So tell us a little about shame and why it might be difficult to detect in some people are, or at least begin to be aware of.

Speaker 2: Yes. Well, shame is a different sort of emotion than some of the other common ones. Like, for example, if you ask people, where do you feel fear in your body? Most people will point to their belly or their solar plexus somewhere down here where they feel butterflies in the stomach. Let's say, if you ask people, where do you feel your sadness in your body? Many people will associate it with they'll touch their hearts or their feel, you know, where they felt heartache or heartsick. And where do you feel your anger? If you talk to people they will often say, well, I feel it up here. I can touch my jaws or my neck tightens. So our more common feelings have body locations that makes them easier to find. But shame is often more diffuse. When you ask people, where do you feel your shame? Well, some people have never felt it before, so it takes them a while to locate it because it's kind of in the background behind a whole lot of more louder feelings, like fear and anger and sadness. And so I think that's one reason. It took me a while to detected in myself because like the story I tell in the book, there was one moment where do I have time to tell the story?

Speaker 1: Yeah. Please tell it. It's an amazing story. I think it's okay.

Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, my brother and I were down helping clean out my mother's house after she passed away in 1990. So this goes back now 30 years. And so I was handling a picture frame and I'm moving it to a different place. And out of the back of the picture frame, Nella envelope and a letter that was addressed to my mother and I looked at it and I opened it. Oh, and by the way, it was postmarked 1945, which was the year I was born. And so I opened the letter to see what it said. And it was this heart wrenching letter from her church group at the Methodist church that she belonged to saying, please, Norma, you've got to come back to the group. You can't just sit in your house and feel ashamed. I know the birth, wasn't the way you would have wanted it to be in everything, but we love you.

Speaker 2: And we accept you and please come back, just, don't cut us off. Don't cut off. And I realized, this is me. They're talking about, you know, and I felt this, I could feel my mother's shame. And then I realized, Oh my goodness. I feel that all over my body. I particularly felt it in my legs. I remember at the time. And, and so that was a moment of great awakening for me, just owning that kind of shame and understanding what that might be about. It gave me this tremendous compassion for my mother. You know, that because her way of dealing with those kinds of feelings, that dolphin not been good, you know, she various, uh, she was a heavy smoker and she would just, I think instead of whenever she would get into any kind of anxiety or sadness or anything, she would just light up another cigarette.

Speaker 2: And so she, and that's eventually what killed her. So it was, uh, it was part of a whole sad chain of events. But what it did for me was I realized after I felt this new territory opened up in my body, I realized, you know, I Slack a farmer, discovering a new field out there and realizing, Hey, that could be planted. Even though it's got some weeds in it or garlic or something in it. Now I could replant it with roses if I want it. And that's where the idea came to me of anything. You're willing to feel anything like fear, anger, sadness, shame, whatever it is, feel it, and then rededicate it as an attractor field for love and luck. So that was the breakthrough moment I realized, Hey, I've got this new territory. I'll just make it about attracting love and luck. And so that was a great gift of it.

Speaker 1: That moment. I was fascinated by that because it was another lightening bolt. I was like, how in the heck is he keep doing this in this book? Because I've read it before. And I read it again, thinking, I just want to understand something different, but it struck me the shame. That's using a microscope of my awareness to try to feel it in my body and go, where is this? What shame do I have? And it struck me. I was like, Oh, it's living right here in this part of my body, my back. It feels like the blood pressure challenges I have. I was like, this is something that lives in me. That's always been here. I know the feeling, the sensation. I just pull away from it when it comes, because it doesn't feel good. I was like, Oh, this is where my luck is. What a wonderful place for it to be in this feeling like I don't belong or I'm not accepted. I go, Oh finally, I know why that feeling is there. It is not to cause me pain or misery is to help me grow in my luck in abundance. It was a beautiful moment today. I just want to tell you, I was struck by this.

Speaker 2: I'm so happy to hear that, by the way, I just remembered who you remind me off. If you bumped into Lin Manuel Miranda in your life,

Speaker 1: I have not.

Speaker 2: Well, you'd be like, if you grew a little beard, people would have trouble on the street. They, I mean, you'd have trouble walking down the street. Cause they'd all think you were Lin Manuel. [inaudible]

Speaker 1: Awesome. I'm good. Maybe that's my next costume. I just watched Hamilton was blown away by that when we were so inspiring, I got to see it up in there

Speaker 2: Before the thing closed down and I was just blown away by it. I it's one thing I always get fascinated by is what the audience does right at the end of a play. And it was one of a couple of times in my life where the audience, as one person, 800 people jumped to their feet, screaming, you know, it was just like, Oh, electricity. I remember that row. That feeling.

Speaker 1: Yeah. It's an incredible one. A creator can do that in some way, even without knowing what they're doing. I think that's the power of great, beautiful art, like books. It brings out something that's collectively is already right there. So I love that. I was such a great play and I haven't seen it live, but I enjoyed the movie so much. I know we have a few more minutes. I want to ask you about, for some people, how has like different or connected to manifestation because sometimes I want people to understand the nuance here so that people can get a sense of how to understand each little piece of understanding helps them like create a new awareness. Could you give us a little definition or at least an understanding

Speaker 2: They're very closely related because your ability to create conscious luck in your life is similar and very similar to the kind of opening you have to have to create anything in your life. I always, when I teach manifestation, I teach three that it occurs in three levels because the first level, which is basically the moment you create a new positive thought about anything, let's say you have a moment where in the current context we're talking about where you say, okay, I'm willing to be luckier every day of my life. That's a new positive thought about the area of luck, or let's say you've been wounded in love. And you've been kind of in retreat for a while, and you've not been opening your heart to a relationship. Well, there's a moment. And I've been through that moment where you suddenly say, okay, that was then this is now.

Speaker 2: I still want to be in a relationship. And I'm willing to get back into the game again. You know? And so many of us have been through that kind of moment. And so that moment of opening is the same thing as creates luck and creates anything else because you admit a new positive thought into something that's been in the grip of a limiting belief. So that's stage one of manifestation. I call that the Newtonian stage because Newton's idea about for every action, creating a new thought, there's an equal and opposite reaction. Your old negative thought about it before has been creating reactions. And then you shift and consciously create a new set of interactions around a new positive thoughts. So that's the Newtonian. The second wave though of manifestation is really fascinating. I call that the Einsteinian phase because they're the task is to love the barriers to open up to the barriers and learn to the barriers.

Speaker 2: Many of your listeners and viewers have probably heard real because famous quote about opening up and learning to love the question as rooms that you're unlocking, you know, learning to love the questions themselves rather than pursuing the answers because in the Einsteinian phase, you're learning to love the unlovable in yourself. You're learning to love the unlovable in your characters, because even the most unlovable character needs to be presented with love, you know, because it's the author's gift to the world. It comes out of love. And so Stephen King, I admire him a great deal. You know, he, he's a very heartful open-hearted guy that just creates stuff in the horror realm. So the third stage of manifestation is the conscious luck phase though, because I call it quantum. And in the quantum phase, what happens is you follow energies around that allow you to be in the right place at the right time. There's a wonderful Kathleen rein poem about birds following pathways across the sky. What are those invisible pathways that guide us? How do we find those invisible pathways? So the big leap opens that door and conscious luck really gets people grounded. I think in this idea of steering through the world, by making adjustments that allow you to catch greater and greater wind currents,

Speaker 1: That's such an amazing example. And there's so many great things here. I mean, honestly, I feel like I could study each of the eight principles separately and probably before like a meal completely because I know that's how I felt by just re revisiting the book and that any time you can open up your heart and mind to something new and start to accept it and observe it, like that's the thing I've observed is I'm incredibly lucky since the moment I decided to be. And when I observed my life, I was like, Oh, I've always been incredibly lucky in ways that I can't describe. And there's nothing I am particularly doing different than another human being. In fact, I'm less likely to be successful because of certain things. And that's how I know I'm looking like I really shouldn't be doing the things I'm doing if you use logic, but when luck it's all possible for me.

Speaker 1: And I wanna encourage people, you heard the music of the book. Yeah. Oh wait, I loved that. It had that. It had eight steps. I love that. It felt like this infinite number that could go on and on and on to describe this process of luck. I felt really confident that this book is going to change lots of people's lives. And I felt like maybe, you know, it made me wonder, and this is a question I still have lingering before we go, which is, you know, you've had an amazing career of helping lead people, being a teacher, being a guide, opening up the hearts and minds of people's abilities through these wonderful books. How do you perceive or see another group of people rising? Because it must, it should, and must continue. As we pass on these things, to help other people, where can we encourage people who are sitting in their home, listening to us, their ears are watching this thinking, why am I want to write a book? How do we encourage people that they might have something worthy to tell people when often those are the people who probably need to speak up, who don't, how do we call the future leaders, teachers, mentors, guides, to do work that you're doing. I mean, they could easily say, well, you went to stand for you to these things. That's for you. Not for me. What would your advice to call people forward me?

Speaker 2: Well, I'm grateful to Stanford and grateful to have a doctorate from there and all of that kind of thing. But in my personal experience, some of the most enlightened people I've ever met were people that didn't even graduate from high school. So I don't think it has to do so much with the books you read or something that that's part of it. Of course, I think it's good to enlighten yourself in every possible way. But another thing is that down in each of us all, I think we have the urge to grow and the urge to assist the growth of other people. And along the way that often gets distorted because sometimes we have something happen that puts a crimp in our ability to be there for ourselves or be there for other people. And then that crimp has to be kind of move through and work through and opened up to and clarified so that you can be free of that.

Speaker 2: But like the Leonard Cohen song says there's a crack in everything. That's where the light gets in. That's such an important idea to keep in mind that inside us all, there is this, you mentioned that great sunlight example. You know, that sunlight is free, but if you can find a way to amplify it, you know, that it's like, if you hold up a Juul to the sun, there's millions of refractions that come off of that. And so each of us can ride that beam down into the center of ourselves and say, what is that particular beam that's moving through us? So here's my homework assignment for everybody. That's listening, watching, go in a room by yourself. This is when executives come here and pay us $20,000 for a day. This is the first thing they do. So if you go and do this, you can have a $20,000 mini experience here, go in a room by yourself where you're not going to be disturbed for 10 minutes and ask yourself what I call a wonder question. And a wonder question goes like this, here's your wonder question. And just keep asking this for 10 minutes in your mind. What do I love to do more than anything else

Speaker 1: Love to do more than anything.

Speaker 2: And we recommend just meditating on that, circulate it through your mind and breathe with it, circulate it through your mind, but live in that question for 10 minutes, because that's the key to everything, finding out what you most love to do, and then learning how to do your work from that space. When I first had that idea, I was only spending 10% of my time in my genius zone on the genius spiral. 10% of my time, that was horrifying when I first realized that. But then I said, okay, let me aim for first of all, 30%. And so I worked for a couple of years and I got, so I was spending 30% of my time doing what I most love to do. Then I went for 50% that took a few years. Then I went for 70%. But for the last 20 years, I've spent 90% of my time doing what I most love to do. And then 10% of my time I get around from place to place or have to drive my car to the airport or something like that. But gee nine out of 10 minutes of my life, nine out of 10 hours of my life doing what I most love to do. That means I've been on vacation basically, even though I've been writing books and everything else for the past 20 years, since it's all stuff that I love to do, there is no stress associated with it, right?

Speaker 1: That's great homework. I think everyone should do. I'll definitely do that. Spend my time. And my next meditation time doing that, I feel like the more I live in the way you just described, it's not work. I don't work for a living. I just am. It's beautiful. And my life grows in abundance success and love every day as I inspire others because of you. Thank you so much for this amazing opportunity to share your wisdom. Definitely. If you are wondering, could I be lucky to get the book, get the book conscious luck. It's an amazing book. We'll link it up in the show notes as well as the other books that gage written, because I want you to read this, start your journey on having a more full, abundant, beautiful life gay. Would you like us to go? Of course, we're linked to other sites, but to learn more about you as they kind of find themselves probably being drawn to you from your teachings here today.

Speaker 2: Well, thank you. So, and also, I just want to appreciate you for the work you're doing because you and I are in the same business of helping people find better and better tools for living their lives. So I appreciate your contribution to that. Thank you. One good place to go is to go to conscious luck.com. You'll find out lots about, and Carol there, and also can sign up for a couple of the bonuses that go along with the book when you buy it. My wife and I, Katie and I have a hendrix.com, which is kind of our main website, H E N D R I C K s.com. And we also have our foundation for conscious living our not for profit foundation that we have that is@foundationforconsciousliving.com. So there's various ways to find out about us, but one of those could do it for you.

Speaker 1: Okay. Again, thank you for filling the abundant part of my life, which is having you on my show. It's been such a joy. Thank you so much. Thank you for listening again, to another episode of authors who lead, we appreciate you being here and we hope you subscribe. So you get this delivered to your device every week. And if you haven't left us a review, please do so. It really helps. And if you have a book in your heart, you've been wanting to write a book, please go to authors who lead.com and join us on this journey of becoming a published author.

Gay Hendricks has been a leader in the fields of relationship transformation and body-mind transformation for more than 45 years. Gay has written more than 40 books. His latest book, Conscious Luck, reveals eight ways to change your fortunes through the power of intention. 

His bestsellers include Five Wishes, The Big Leap, Conscious Loving, and Conscious Loving Ever After, (the last two co-authored with his co-author and wife, Dr. Kathlyn Hendricks). Gay is also a mystery novelist, with a series of five books featuring the Tibetan-Buddhist private detective, Tenzing Norbu, as well as a new mystery series featuring a Victorian-era London detective, Sir Errol Hyde. 

After earning his Ph.D. from  Stanford in 1974, Gay served as Professor of Counseling Psychology at the University of Colorado for 21 years. Gay has appeared on more than 500 radio and television shows, including Oprah, CNN, CNBC, 48 HOURS, and others.

What We Discuss with Gay Hendricks:

  • How he’s able to write books about the inner knowing
  • Do people miss their zone of genius?
  • Gay’s book writing process
  • The definition of luck and what luck isn’t
  • Why people perceive luck in one way or another
  • The transformation that happens with shame
  • The 3 stages of manifestation
  • The $20,000-homework that could change your life!

[02:15] Writing About Self-Discovery Books

One of the big principles in The Big Leap is opening up to your natural genius found inside, which Gay calls the genius spiral. And once you open up to that, it carries you into life in a different way. It carries you into places that bring forth your genius more.

Gay’s initial intention was to start with something fundamentally true for himself that he just got to share it. And this is where all his books have come from. 

Even as a mystery novelist, Gay got interested in such genre ten years ago, for his entertainment. Not having found a good mystery novel that he liked, he decided to invent one for himself. Now, he’s on his second series, which is his current passion.

[06:55] How People Miss Their Zone of Genius

No matter what culture, there are people who don’t see their genius spiral. As Albert Einstein once said, everybody is a genius. But we start teaching dogs to climb trees and cats to chase mailmen. We get lost in training people and overlooking their true genius.

The very things that cause us pain are the vehicle to ride our genius through. We all carry a spiritual center within us. Once we discover that, we have the power to transform our lives.

Gay’s books are geared towards reminding readers of what they already know and feel deep inside. 

[13:20] Gay’s Book Writing Process

When Gay is conceptualizing a book, he goes into a bookstore and stands in the section where the book will be sold. Then he puts himself in the person’s place who’s in there looking around. He imagines what the person is feeling and what the person wants and needs. He thinks about that avatar to help him get his voice on the line. Once he gets the voice of a particular book, the book almost writes itself. 

For instance, The Big Leap is written for the coaching community who wanted to have a map to help them get into people’s hearts and souls. Additionally, he’s also looking to target a person who’s not been coached but is interested in how to transform their life and moving to the next level.

We are very large and contain multitudes of things within us. Our job is to open up to those things, own them, and turn them into our creative process.

It’s all about a continuous process of expansion in the self. The author has to keep opening up to new dimensions in themselves. 

[19:09] Writing Conscious Luck

Co-written with Carol Klein, Gay wrote the first half of the book while Carol offered to write the second half that included all the processes, exercises, and activities are and interviews

Conscious luck means arranging for good things to happen at all times by being in the right place at the right time.

Luck is not about winning the lottery or a 12-volt lightning strike, or something you’re born with. And what Carol and Gay discovered through researching eight different ways that people have made themselves luckier is that luck is more like a wind that’s always blowing, and if you can adjust the wings and sails to it, you can get to places that you never imagined in a much less effortful way by learning to ride the currents.

[29:50] The Transformation That Happens with Shame

Shame is a different sort of emotion than some of the other common ones. If you ask people, where do you feel fear in your body, most people will point to their belly or their solar plexus where they feel butterflies in the stomach. 

Our more common feelings have body locations that make them easier to find. But shame is often more diffused. But when you ask people where they feel their shame, it takes a while for them to locate it.

Be willing to feel anything like fear, anger, sadness, shame – whatever it is, feel it, and then rededicate it as an attractor field for love and luck. Make it about attracting love and luck. 

[37:00] The 3 Stages of Manifestation

Your ability to create conscious luck in your life is very similar to the kind of opening. Manifestation occurs in three levels. 

1. The Newtonian Stage

Newton’s idea is that for every action, there’s an equal and opposite reaction. This is the moment you create a new positive thought about anything. It creates luck because you admit a new positive thought into something that’s been in the grip of a limiting belief. 

2. The Einsteinian Phase

The task is to open up to the barriers and learn to love the barriers. Learn to love the questions themselves rather than pursuing the answers. In this phase, you’re learning to love the unlovable in yourself and your character because even the most unlovable character needs to be presented with love.

3. The Conscious Luck or the Quantum Phase 

You follow energies around that allow you to be in the right place at the right time. We steer through the world by making adjustments.

[42:39] Advice to Aspiring Writers

Down in each of us all, we have the urge to grow and assist the growth of other people. Along the way, that often gets distorted because sometimes something happens that puts a crimp in our ability to be there for ourselves or be there for other people. And that has to be moved through, worked through, opened up to, and clarified so that you can be free of that. 

Go in a room by yourself where you’re not going to be disturbed for 10 minutes, and ask yourself this wonder question: “What do I love to do more than anything else?”

Then meditate on that. Circulate it through your mind and breathe with it. Live in that question for 10 minutes because that’s the key to everything. Find out what you love to do the most then learn how to do your work from that space.

Episode Resources:

Get to know more about Gay Hendricks:



Foundation for Conscious Living

Gay Hendricks’ books:

Conscious Luck

Five Wishes

The Big Leap

Conscious Loving

Conscious Loving Ever After

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